INC NEWS - [DSIC] Re: [pac2] RE: [DSIC] Panhandling Thoughts from Terry Allebaugh

Wed Jan 25 22:04:29 EST 2006

That's good news that we are not considering a ban.  I'm glad to hear it, as
thus far we had been discussing a ban.  Based on your notes below, I wonder
how Lewis Cheek's proposal got misrepresented so badly.  It will be helpful
to have the proposal so that we can read it and discuss the details.  The
minutes will be very helpful for those of us who were not at the meeting.
It sounds like the meeting was informative and productive.

Newman

  _____  

From: DSIC at googlegroups.com [mailto:DSIC at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken
Gasch
Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 9:05 PM
To: DSIC at googlegroups.com; pac2 at yahoogroups.com; Newman Aguiar;
inc-list at durhaminc.org
Subject: [DSIC] Re: [pac2] RE: [DSIC] Panhandling Thoughts from Terry
Allebaugh

Newman,

I was at the INC meeting last night.  Lewis Cheek's proposed changes to our
panhandling ordinance is not a ban at all.  He made some very good points in
his presentation that we are overlooking.  As presented last night, part of
the proposal works to connect those in need with resources.  

Before we scrap the entire proposal, let's get a copy of it for everyone to
read.  

Another point that seems to have been overlooked is one of abused jail
space.  A percentage of our homeless population uses the jail as a place to
get lodging, food and medical attention.  Not only is this astronomically
expensive, but it robs our community of space where we could be housing our
suspected murderers.

I will obtain a copy of the proposal from Mr. Cheek and submit it to these
groups in the next few days.

Also, we should wait until the minutes of the INC meeting are released.

Ken Gasch

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Newman Aguiar <mailto:newman at nc.rr.com>  

To: DSIC at googlegroups.com ; pac2 at yahoogroups.com 

Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 8:46 AM

Subject: [pac2] RE: [DSIC] Panhandling Thoughts from Terry Allebaugh

I think Michael has done a super job of helping us understand why addressing
panhandling as a crime is not only an improper use of the broken windows
theory, but also why applying such a ban would likely have very little
impact on our crime or on the problem of panhandling.

Terry's message is also right on.  Panhandling is a social issue, and I
believe that we will be successful in addressing it if we, as a community,
treat it as such.  In my view, the ban on panhandling is the wrong way to go
about it.  The existing City ordinance already gives us a good tool to help
us manage it.  We are not the first city to look at this issue and it is
clear from other attempts to ban panhandling that they have failed to
eliminate the problem.

>From the messages that I have read on this issue, it seems to me that
whether it is because we believe it is for safety, or appearance, or
whatever, we all generally agree that we must do something to help.  Michael
has offered some good suggestions to help create information packets to
assist these individuals.  Also, as Terry points out, I think we would have
more success if, instead of offering money to panhandlers, we can connect
them to resources that can offer them sustainable assistance.

I recognize that panhandling is a serious problem in downtown and in the
unscientific survey that I posted to the PAC lists, panhandling was very
high on the list of concerns.  Perhaps, if we can get past our effort to ban
panhandling, we can move forward with real solutions that will help us
address the panhandling issue. 

Cheers,

Newman

  _____  

From: DSIC at googlegroups.com [mailto:DSIC at googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken
Gasch
Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 7:26 AM
To: pac2 at yahoogroups.com; inc-list at durhaminc.org; DSIC at googlegroups.com
Cc: terry allebaugh
Subject: [DSIC] Panhandling Thoughts from Terry Allebaugh

The INC had invited Terry Allebaugh of Housing for New Hope to attend last
night's panel discussion on panhandling.  Terry could not make the meeting.
Because his experience is valuable to this discussion, we asked him if he
would be willing to put together some thoughts on the issue to be shared
with the group.  Below are his thoughts.  - Ken Gasch

----- Original Message ----- 

From: TeeBaugh4 at aol.com 

To: ken.gasch at hldproductions.com 

Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2006 4:52 PM

Subject: Re: Proposed Panhandling Ban

Ken:
  It is late in the day so I am not sure if you will get this in time for
tonight's meeting, but I hope so. It was good to talk to with you yesterday,
and I am glad there is a group meeting to discuss the issue of panhandling.
What follows are a few thoughts to share with the group if appropriate.
  First I think panhandling is a social and, at times a safety issue, that
warrants the response of a thinking and caring community. I don't think it
is a criminal issue, and attempts to render it so across the country have
either blatantly walked over people's individual rights or have done little
to reduce or eliminate its presence. There is something illogical about
fining a homeless person or poor person and/or jailing them as a deterrent.
If we really want a legal component I would suggest that if we criminalize
panhandling, then perhaps we should arrest the one gives money. Using the
analogy of prostitution, both parties are guilty of a crime. I say that in
jest, but only to lead to my main thought which is this:
I think the key to curbing panhandling is to work the supply side of the
matter, the givers. I would like to see a major promotional campaign
undertaken that encourages all of Durham to say no to panhandlers and say
yes to getting involved to support a community-wide effort to end
homelessness. In March, Durham will unveil its 10 Year Plan to End
Homelessness, which many of us in Durham have been working to develop. One
strategy is to develop housing that is service-enriched for the chronically
homeless, many of whom suffer from mental illness, poor health, and
addiction. Some of these folks are who you are seeing out there. The body
they found in woods off 15-501 a few weeks ago was one of these guys.
  While we are working on implementing longer term solutions like this, a
step to take now would be to encourage people not to give to panhandlers.
Empower people to say no, while also making sure the City and County have
established a call-in number where people can be referred, and that adequate
staffing is in place to respond to people's need. Advertise in churches the
importance of saying no to panhandlers, and simultaneously organize teams to
do outreach to deliver food and a caring presence. 
  Panhandling is not a police issue. If a panhandler is threatening, it's
not panhandling, it's robbery, and we have laws for that. 
  Okay, there's a few thoughts. I hope I will have the opportunity to
interact with your group in the future. 

Terry

Terry Allebaugh, Executive Director
Housing for New Hope
(919) 220-3777
TeeBaugh4 at aol.com 

***

The opinions expressed herein represent the views of the individual and do
not necessarily represent the views of Partners Against Crime - District II
(PAC2) or any other organization. Any use of the material on this listserv
other than for the purpose of discussion on this listserv is strictly
prohibited without the knowledge and consent of the person responsible for
such opinion.

***

For more information: http://www.pac2durham.com 
to post message: pac2 at yahoogroups.com; 
to subscribe:  pac2-subscribe at yahoogroups.com; to unsubscribe:
pac2-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com 

*** Neighbors and friends: in order to keep traffic on this list focused on
crime prevention, please do not post virus warnings or personal replies to
this list. Thanks! ***

  _____  

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS 

*	 Visit your group "pac2 <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pac2> " on
the web.

*	 To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
 pac2-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
<mailto:pac2-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> 

*	 Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>  Terms of Service. 

  _____  

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.deltaforce.net/mailman/private/inc-list/attachments/20060125/c7114761/attachment-0001.htm