INC NEWS - Neighborhood Advocate: request for more information
TheOcean1 at aol.com
TheOcean1 at aol.com
Fri May 16 01:11:59 EDT 2008
Randy & All
Want to remain on topic as Ronnie suggests, but don't want to ignore Randy's
sidebar either.
Randy asks:
"So why do we need someone to advocate a set of rules that we have a staff
of paid governmental employees already following?"
I'll admit I once took that same stance, wondering if we were asking for an
umpire to monitor the umpires if this were baseball. Most baseball games have
calls that everyone can't agree on, but employing umps to referee the umps
doesn't make sense.
>From the neighborhood's perspective, this request isn't generated from the
position that the City staff doesn't know what they are doing, it's from
thinking we neighborhoods don't understand that system well enough to react
properly. It's a well rehearsed routine for the usual players, but for the
neighborhoods, it's a first time experience... almost every time.
Our heavily "neighborhood oriented" nature is probably Durham's strongest
suit.
The city staff appointed to interfacing with the public are doing a good
job, but the neighborhood's ability to deal with the city still varies from one
issue to another, and from one neighborhood to another, dependent on that
particular neighborhood's ability to field an often unexpected pitch... keeping
this on a baseball theme.
The developers are always pro, the city and county must remain neutral in a
perfect world, that leaves the neighborhoods to defend themselves, if need be,
and IF they can organize fast enough, and learn the same ropes the
neighborhood before them learned.
I'm in favor of a neighborhood advocate.
Bill Anderson
In a message dated 5/15/2008 10:48:34 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
randy at 27beverly.com writes:
We already have a "staff" doing this job. They're called City/County
Planning. But for some reason, and short of hearing the same few
"mistakes", could anyone tell us why their collective knowledge and wisdom
is not to be trusted? There may be some gaps in the UDO that need fixing,
and there may be some less-than-qualified folks in the Planning Department
that should be removed, but it's a set of rules that they follow as well
as developers. It's not like they get to adjust them one way or the other
to make developers happy. And to even think that is absurd. They're the
same rules that everyone follows!
So why do we need someone to advocate a set of rules that we have a staff
of paid governmental employees already following? It just seems so
redundant to add another layer of uncertainty. And like Mikes asks, who
will this NA support; the neighborhoods (or just some small faction of it
that thinks it's more right), the City/County by which feeds his/her
family as an employee, or some other yet to be determined bunch? Unless
it's a HOA doing the asking, I know of no neighborhood association in town
that even speaks for half of the population of the particular
neighborhood. Take Trinity Park for example; there are three different
associations/HOA's/groups there. Which one is more right? And which one
does the NA speak for on an issue?
The best thing that can happen anywhere across this City/County is to
organize neighborhoods. They become better places to live (in most cases)
when they all get together regularly and discuss what's going on. And who
am I (or you) to be the one who decides what is right or wrong for a
particular neighborhood? Take Turnage Heights for example (since it keeps
coming up as the poster child). Not everyone there was against it; just a
vocal few who took it as about as far as they could to stop the warehouse
from happening. And that's typically the case. Most neighborhoods are
filled with neighbors who really don't care what's going on around them
because life itself is tough enough. So why should anyone impose what they
think is right on a neighborhood that, in general, could care less? I
certainly don't think it would be right.
I don't see very much happening in the development business around here
that is not scrutinized and re-scrutinized before it finally gets approved
(and they all don't!). And if rezoning has to happen, then certainly the
public has a great opportunity for input. But if it is zoned for what a
developer desires to build, who (and in this case it would be anybody)
should be able to say a developer shouldn't build it because for whatever
reason, someone who lives nearby doesn't like the idea? I don't think
there is any substitute for paying attention....
We developed a number of neighborhoods around here in the 80's. We didn't
have (as John suggests) " the financial resources and teams of experts --
lawyers, land planners and designers, traffic and civil engineers,
consultants, lobbyists and others -- to ensure their plans comply with the
standard required for approval." We did it as I suggested earlier on a
shoe string budget. We joint ventured many of the parts of the development
because of the financial resources necessary. And slowing down the process
only added to the burden. Some of the folks on this list live in these
neighborhoods. I doubt they even consider what it took to develop the
neighborhood they live in. And the new neighborhoods on the planning board
now will be no different. Future neighbors/shoppers/workers will need it
all as well.
What bothers me and a number of others in our community is the lack of
commercial and industrial land available for development. Without these
two types of land available (and a general resistance to rezone land to
make them so), our tax base will grow on the residential side but will not
have the commercial and industrial tax base to keep our taxes on an even
course. Because of the added burden residential units place on the service
end of our government, taxes will continue to climb even though we're
adding housing units at an accelerated rate. Without industry and
commercial to balance it out, there is no end to how high the taxes will
go. So consider this the next time you don't want a commercial property in
your neighborhood (much less an industrial one). Without them, we're taxed
to death in residential...
RWP
27 Beverly
> Let's please remain on topic and the very astute questions raised by Mike.
> This is vital matter for all in Durham and our region. It appears there
> are differences in understanding and even the Neighborhood Advocate may
> not
> be the best or final name for this function. Will it be one person or a
> staff, etc.?
>
> Ronnie
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <bragin at nc.rr.com>
> To: "Mike - Hotmail" <mwshiflett at hotmail.com>
> Cc: <inc-list at DurhamINC.org>
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:04 PM
> Subject: Re: INC NEWS - Neighborhood Advocate: request for more
> information
>
>
>> "Half of our City Council members (actually 3 of 7) are elected via a
>> Ward
>> system. What's the communication channel for this person if there's a
>> difference in opinion between them and the NA? "
>>
>> I don't believe this is entirely accurate. Although the "ward" system
>> requires that the candidate reside within the "ward" all of our
>> elections
>> are actually at-large. That is, even the "ward" representatives are
>> voted
>> on by the entire city.
>>
>>
>> ---- Mike - Hotmail <mwshiflett at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> =============
>> John,
>>
>> Would it be possible for someone to post again the role and
>> responsibilities
>> that are being asked of the Neighborhood Advocate again?
>>
>> For instance, I've read that this person would report directly to the
>> City
>> Manager.
>>
>> If this is correct, would this person have the authority to overrule
>> other
>> Department Heads (Planning, Neighborhood Improvement Services, Housing
>> and
>> Community Development) in their role as a neighborhood advocate?
>>
>> Which 'voice' would the neighborhood advocate represent? The
>> neighborhood
>> association? The board of an NA? The board of an HOA?
>> over what the staff recommends. Is there a formal procedure that
>> neighborhoods need to follow to give the Neighborhood Advocate the
>> ability
>> to speak for them? What if a neighborhood isn't organized? Can a few
>> people speak for a neighborhood without some sort of authority to do so?
>>
>> Where does the Planning Commission recommendations place if there's a
>> difference in opinions between the two?
>>
>> What happens if a neighborhood is split or still isn't sure about what's
>> in
>> it's best interest in a timely manner? Which position will a NA
>> 'represent'.
>>
>> I've also read that it's been suggested that this position be a legal
>> person, have legal training or be an attorney. If so, isn't there a
>> direct conflict of interest if they are being paid by the city but
>> supposedly representing neighborhood interests as their primary job
>> responsibility?
>>
>> A white paper describing this initiative would be very helpful.
>>
>> Aren't our elected officials supposed to function in the role of
>> representing their community? Who's voice should be heard over the
>> other
>> if there's a difference in opinions? Should a person who's hired to
>> fill
>> a
>> position of Neighborhood Advocate hold trump cards over the City Council
>> (one of which is our Mayor)?
>>
>> Half of our City Council members (actually 3 of 7) are elected via a
>> Ward
>> system. What's the communication channel for this person if there's a
>> difference in opinion between them and the NA?
>>
>> Where's our Neighborhood Improvement Services Community Resource
>> personnel
>> fit into this new scheme? Don't they have some of the same job
>> functions
>> that's being proposed for the NA?
>>
>> While I agree there's been some phenomenal missteps lately (i.e. Turnage
>> Heights neighborhood warehouse) adding another layer of administration
>> to
>> the already complex mix of departments and organizational hierarchy,
>> taking the time to make sure we all understand what's being asked of
>> this
>> person in advance would definitely be appreciated.
>>
>> Mike Shiflett
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "John Schelp" <bwatu at yahoo.com>
>> To: <inc-list at DurhamINC.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 9:26 AM
>> Subject: INC NEWS - Plan to shorten development review written by
>> staff,developers & local professionals (planners, engineers &
>> architects)
>>
>>
>>>A comment on Bull City Rising says this plan to
>>> undercut the Planning Commission (and neighborhoods)
>>> was hatched out of a series of meetings held between
>>> "staff, developers, and local professionals (planners,
>>> engineers, and architects)."
>>>
>>> One must wonder why the neighborhoods were left out of
>>> the process?
>>>
>>> One must also begin to wonder why Mayor Bell is
>>> pushing plan that was created without neighborhood
>>> involvement.
>>>
>>> Again, many of the plan's flaws, now being exposed,
>>> could have been addressed had a Neighborhood Advocate
>>> been at the table.
>>>
>>> ~John
>>>
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