[esip-semanticweb] Semantic Web Portal discussion was - Next Sem Web Call - Tomorrow 10/27
Brandon Whitehead
b.whitehead at auckland.ac.nz
Mon Nov 2 00:55:11 EST 2015
Hi John,
I'm changing the subject on this thread in an effort to keep the
discussion from getting lost in ether.
I've been writing a bit about this topic recently so I'd like to chime
in while some of this is still fresh in my mind.
I'm not sure about limiting factors, but there are definitely open
questions in the field, as well as how `we' as a community might
contribute to any potential answers.
Some questions that I have (which appear to overlap quite a bit with
Soren's) are as follows:
1) Who maintains the ontology once it's released into the wild (or
uploaded to a portal)? I mean absolutely no disrespect in pointing out
(as an example) that many links on the mmi portal are dead. And that is
just a link to project or `code'. What about the ontology?
2) Who owns the ontology once it is...portaled? Do ontologies need a
license? Do we treat it as code, or IP, or...both?
3) To my recollection (and it has been a while since I investigated this
particular issue) BioPortal `matches' based on a tokenised string match.
Does BioPortal or MMI ORR have the capability to `match' or suggest
similar classes, properties, etc.? (i.e. intensional and extensional
relationship structures)
4) Perhaps similarly to the previous question, how do we keep track of
conceptual drift?
5) How do we verify and validate these structures (ontology efficacy)?
(i.e. if an ontology is created to do some thing, x; who verifies it
actually does, x?)
There are, of course, others. These are meant to start (well, continue)
the conversation.
One big question that keeps jumping out me is, who decides? Who gets to
decide any or all of these things? Is it a person? A committee? How
are they empowered?
As a final discussion point, the Bioinformatics community (down the road
from me) have a full time staffed position (I believe they have 2,
actually) working as a `curator'. Their job is to make sure all the
models submitted for publication (and archive in their data structure)
meet certain criteria and maintain all the model versions, etc. I only
present it here as I find it is an interesting solution to some similar
problems they were dealing with.
Apologies. This got away from me a bit. Hopefully it's still somewhat
coherent.
Kia Ora,
/Brandon
------
Brandon Whitehead, GISP
ESIP Student Fellow | Semantic Web Cluster
Centre for eResearch &
School of Environment
The University of Auckland | Te Whare Wānanga o Tàmaki Makaurau
m: +64 21835519
On 11/02/2015 04:52 PM, John Graybeal via esip-semanticweb wrote:
>> I'd like to suggest, as a generalist with no institutional stakes in
>> this, that we leave a place for alternatives to the standard web
>> portal with an upload form and a linear search. My sense is that we're
>> hitting the limits of those …
>
> Hi Soren,
>
> With my BioPortal hat on (as of today, I'm the lead of the BioPortal
> project -- please be nice to me in this role for a while :->), I'd like
> to explore what you mean by this.
>
> A 'standard web portal' can cover a wide ground, with APIs and all sort
> of other things, and still have an upload form and a 'linear' (=
> simple?) search. But it can also provide many other things -- these
> things aren't a constraint. I know BioPortal is very interested in
> pursuing these directions.
>
> And if I slip my MMI ORR hat on for a sec, it has supported
> straightforward authorship, credit, and provenance metadata entry since
> it started; supporting other features would not be hard to add.
>
> So can you spell out what exactly is the limiting factor you are
> concerned about? Are you just calling out high-functioning capabilities
> like faceted search and community-anointed ontologies? Or is it more of
> the cultural, workflow, and publication social practices?
>
> John
>
> P.S. I've included my Stanford contact info below, and my email there is
> jgraybeal at stanford.com <mailto:jgraybeal at stanford.com>. BioPortal
> questions should be directed to the usual support lists, or to me at
> that address. While I try to keep up with my *other* work mail
> (jbgraybeal at mindspring.com <mailto:jbgraybeal at mindspring.com>, the one I
> have on all these lists) daily, but it's tough.
>
> ---------------------------------------
> John Graybeal
> Technical Program Manager
> Center for Expanded Data Annotation and Retrieval / NCBO BioPortal
> Biomedical Informatics Research Division
> Stanford University School of Medicine
> 650-736-1632
>
>
>
>
>
> On Oct 31, 2015, at 11:14, soren scott via esip-semanticweb
> <esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org
> <mailto:esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org>> wrote:
>
>> Line, agreed - ownership, maintainership, preservation,
>> discoverability, credit and citations... Longterm financial support.
>>
>> I'd like to suggest, as a generalist with no institutional stakes in
>> this, that we leave a place for alternatives to the standard web
>> portal with an upload form and a linear search. My sense is that we're
>> hitting the limits of those as we deal with graph data, bigger data
>> stores and the need to signal more things (quality, trust, authorship,
>> credit, etc). Longer term concerns but we are talking about changing
>> the culture and technology we use needs to support that. Stepping off
>> the soapbox now.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Soren
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 30, 2015 at 8:00 PM, Pouchard, Line C <pouchard at purdue.edu
>> <mailto:pouchard at purdue.edu>> wrote:
>>
>> Soren:
>>
>> This is an important topic, well worth exploring, and find
>> solutions to. We have encountered that with the ESIP Semantic Web
>> Portal, where people can add their ontologies or rely on the
>> portal administrators to do so. The portal software requires a
>> contact person and email, and it’s not always clear who that
>> should be. In addition, when ontologies are extended, we get into
>> versioning issues that bear on governance: for instance, what
>> happens when a new version changes “ownership”?
>>
>> —
>> Line Pouchard, PhD
>> Assistant Professor, Purdue Libraries
>> Computational Science Information Specialist
>> Stewart Center, Room 345____
>> 504 W. State Street____
>> West Lafayette, IN 47907-2058
>> linepouchard at gmail.com <mailto:linepouchard at gmail.com> (alternate
>> email)
>>
>>
>>
>> From: esip-semanticweb <esip-semanticweb-bounces at lists.esipfed.org
>> <mailto:esip-semanticweb-bounces at lists.esipfed.org>> on behalf of
>> soren scott via esip-semanticweb
>> <esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org
>> <mailto:esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org>>
>> Reply-To: soren scott <sorenscott at gmail.com
>> <mailto:sorenscott at gmail.com>>
>> Date: Thursday, October 29, 2015 at 2:06 PM
>> To: Nancy Hoebelheinrich <nhoebel at kmotifs.com
>> <mailto:nhoebel at kmotifs.com>>
>> Cc: ESIP Semantic Web Cluster <esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org
>> <mailto:esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org>>
>>
>> Subject: Re: [esip-semanticweb] Next Sem Web Call - Tomorrow 10/27
>>
>> I'm not sure we'd get all of the interested parties to the semweb
>> business meeting. Just given the timing and all of these kinds of
>> discussions independently ramping up at the same time, it would be
>> beneficial to have a kind of MOU for the spring and then something
>> more structured at the summer meeting. Identify who's in what
>> community WG/IG/cluster to communicate across those parties on the
>> governance activities throughout the spring.
>>
>> Soren
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 11:12 AM, Nancy Hoebelheinrich
>> <nhoebel at kmotifs.com <mailto:nhoebel at kmotifs.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I agree that this would be a good session. Perhaps we could
>> start the discussion at a SemWeb planning discussion at Winter
>> mtg, then bring in people from other ontologies/ organizations
>> to discuss / present for summer? ____
>>
>> Nancy____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> <image001.png> <https://kmotifs.com/>____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Nancy J. Hoebelheinrich____
>>
>> Information Analyst/Principal____
>>
>> nhoebel at kmotifs.com <mailto:nhoebel at kmotifs.com>____
>>
>> San Mateo, CA 94401____
>>
>> (v) 650-302-4493 <tel:650-302-4493>____
>>
>> (f) 650-745-3333 <tel:650-745-3333>____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> *From:*esip-semanticweb
>> [mailto:esip-semanticweb-bounces at lists.esipfed.org
>> <mailto:esip-semanticweb-bounces at lists.esipfed.org>] *On
>> Behalf Of *James Gallagher via esip-semanticweb
>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 29, 2015 10:02 AM
>> *To:* soren scott
>> *Cc:* ESIP Semantic Web Cluster
>> *Subject:* Re: [esip-semanticweb] Next Sem Web Call - Tomorrow
>> 10/27____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> On Oct 29, 2015, at 9:18 AM, soren scott via
>> esip-semanticweb <esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org
>> <mailto:esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org>> wrote:____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Very late to add to the session topics but one to consider
>> at least for the summer:____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> The governance of ontologies, vocabularies, and other
>> shared resources has been coming up across communities
>> (RDA, EarthCube, ESIP, etc) and across domains (semantic
>> web, software sustainability, documentation, and others).
>> The conversations I've been involved with across those
>> areas are often much the same so what can we share about
>> what works and what doesn't? What are the systems that
>> support some of those governance requirements? And our
>> larger who should be responsible for managing these
>> systems and the objects within?____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> I think this would be an excellent session; summer, winter or
>> both.____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> 1+____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> James____
>>
>>
>>
>> ____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> (I include documentation here for things such as code lists
>> (just another structured vocabulary) and schemas.)____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> Cheers,____
>>
>> Soren____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 8:38 AM, Tom Narock via
>> esip-semanticweb <esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org
>> <mailto:esip-semanticweb at lists.esipfed.org>> wrote:____
>>
>> Reminder that our next ESIP Semantic Web Cluster call is
>> tomorrow, 10/27, at 4pm Eastern time. Topics for discussion
>> are the Semantic Web strategic plan and sessions for the
>> upcoming Winter meeting.
>>
>> Let me know if you have any additional topics to add to the
>> agenda.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Tom
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>> __ __
>>
>> --____
>>
>> James Gallagher
>> jgallagher at opendap.org <mailto:jgallagher at opendap.org>____
>>
>> __ __
>>
>>
>>
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