INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

Sat Oct 6 12:36:43 EDT 2007

I regularly witness it.  People often slow down and stop traffic.  I've
also seen people leaving restaurants giving panhandlers money and we
recently dealt with one who was working American Tobacco and a security
guard was keeping him in cash.

Many people are conflicted with more than guilt I believe.   They have
no idea of the dangers and down side and they don't have a clue about
the safety net agencies that already deal with the genuine problems
involved.

From: inc-list-bounces at rtpnet.org [mailto:inc-list-bounces at rtpnet.org]
On Behalf Of pat carstensen
Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 10:48 AM
To: inc-list at durhaminc.org
Subject: Re: INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

I was just wondering -- has anyone ever seen anyone give money to a
panhandler.   For all the time I spend stopped along 15-501, I've never
seen money change hands.  Which makes me think that the panhandlers are
like spammers -- very low success rate but enough traffic that it pays
off.  which makes it sort of a needle in a haystack to find people who
giv emoney.  But every one you convince to stop doing so cuts
significantly into the return on effort for the panhandler.

It would be interesting to see who gives money to panhandlers, how much
they give each time, etc.

Regards, pat

________________________________

From: TheOcean1 at aol.com
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2007 09:50:21 -0400
To: dchristie1 at nc.rr.com; randy at 27beverly.com; inc-list at durhaminc.org
Subject: Re: INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

Look carefully, Randy and Deb! 

The intersections you are concerned about are virtually ALL inside the
City limits. This proposed ban will NOT cover those.

The Durham Can You Spare A Change Campaign is entirely separate and
independent of Lewis Cheek's new law proposal. It merely suggests we not
give money to panhandlers in all areas of Durham.

Perhaps folks would stop standing at any intersection if we, the people
of Durham, were to stop giving them money!

Make sense?

Feel free to support both ideas, but if the intersections are inside the
City of Durham, the proposed ban will not effect them.

Bill Anderson

In a message dated 10/6/2007 3:07:27 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
dchristie1 at nc.rr.com writes:

	I agree with Randy.

	Spare a change and ban panhandlers at intersections.  It is
really 
	dangerous.

	Deb Christie

	----- Original Message ----- 
	From: "RW Pickle" <randy at 27beverly.com>
	To: <inc-list at durhaminc.org>
	Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 12:26 AM
	Subject: INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

	> ban right-of-way solicitation in both the City and County!
	>
	> Durham can spare a change, get these folks off the
right-of-way before
	> someone gets killed! Will it take that before we enact
measures to protect
	> those, which others often say, have substance abuse problems
or mental
	> capacity issues? Does it make any sense to leave these folks
standing in
	> the middle of the road?
	>
	> The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration says that
approximately
	> 6,500 pedestrians and 900 bicyclists are killed each year as a
result of
	> collisions with motor vehicles. They don't split up the
statistics, so you
	> can't see how many were panhandlers. It's not too hard to
believe that it
	> was at least one (of the 6,500). So what if that next one
happened to be
	> on 15-501 in Durham? Is it not our responsibility to act in a
manner that
	> would create a safer environment for both panhandlers and
those in
	> vehicles? How is keeping right-of-way solicitation a daily
norm going to
	> make it any safer? It isn't. And when they get hit, I guess
they can sue
	> the City for allowing them to stand there when the City had an
opportunity
	> to stop them by passing an ordinance. Maybe even get $10
million for being
	> hit...
	>
	> As I said before (and Bill Anderson suggested in his last
post), this is
	> about changing the ideas of those in cars who would roll down
their
	> windows and give these folks something. And I don't care what
you call it
	> and how many fliers you give out, you're not going to change
human nature.
	> We are all taught compassion from an early age; to help those
less
	> fortunate when we can. So now we're going to have this
campaign to change
	> the way we think? I think those supporting this need to change
their
	> minds. You'll never change kindness and generosity. It's human
nature.
	>
	> Those who attended the last INC meeting heard about a new
program in
	> Durham funded by the County, City, and the Triangle United Way
(3 deep
	> pocketed groups). It deals with all the issues these
panhandlers face (or
	> those who support another option would want you to believe);
homelessness,
	> substance abuse, mental illness, and jobs). It would seem to
me that
	> getting behind this already existing (and just getting
started) program
	> would be a much better idea. It addresses all the issues these
panhandlers
	> face and has a staff working toward their agenda. So if the
County passes
	> their right-of-way solicitation ordinance, they are already
working to
	> address the problems that group faces. Then the City can do
the same
	> (since they're funding the new program as well). And the third
party
	> involved with this new program, Triangle United Way, already
funds most of
	> the charitable-help organizations already. So that's huge.
	>
	> Mike Shifflett said in a post earlier in the week:
	>
	> "However, with this amazement also comes a small feeling of
disappointment
	> in the fact that in many cases there already exists or existed
an
	> organization, community group, non-profit or neighborhood
association that
	> actual has worked on that same issue or is currently working
to improve
	> it.
	>
	> Year after year,  new and exciting groups form around the
elections to
	> fight or advocate for more peace, less crime, more housing,
increasing
	> police and law enforcement (read immigration) resources and/or
	> environmental issues.
	>
	> Thing is, in all of these instances, there exists just such a
group of
	> concern citizens who would have loved to have more public
support
	> themselves.
	>
	> But wouldn't it be great if we could all join together and
work as a team?
	> I'm sure it would be more efficient.  I'm more than sure that
the results
	> might be longer lasting as in many instances as these new
groups then
	> either disband or diminish in strength as their particular
issue plays out
	> (win or lose)."
	>
	> This "Durham Can You Spare A Change" idea is just that. It's a
duplication
	> of another program that is actually trying to change things
for those who
	> need it; not change us. The idea that you can change human
nature is just
	> an up-hill battle. It just won't happen. And when one of the
panhandlers
	> is hit and killed... their blood will be on your hands for not
doing
	> something when you had the chance. Get them out of the road
and get them
	> some help. Support the idea of banning right-of-way
solicitation and
	> support the new County, City, and United Way initiative. You
could save a
	> life...
	>
	> RWP
	> 27 Beverly
	>
	> _______________________________________________
	> INC-list mailing list
	> INC-list at rtpnet.org
	> http://lists.deltaforce.net/mailman/listinfo/inc-list
	> 

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