INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

Mon Oct 8 11:52:03 EDT 2007

All,

A week ago from last Thursday (Sept 27th) as I was returning from Raleigh on 70 at the Miami five points intersection and observed a woman in one of those orange vests carrying a white five gallon bucket for some charity or another.

I problem, as I saw it,  wasn't so much the soliciting of funds but the manner in which it was being carried out............in the middle of the intersection!

This particular 'fundraiser'  took it upon herself to leave the safety of the median and walk up to each vehicle as it came to the stop light, sometimes weaving inbetween lanes on foot to get to just one more car before the light turned green!

In my opinion, this behavior not only jeopardized her own life but the safety and smooth operation of those individuals traveling down a very busy state highway in a car weighing in excess of a couple of tons.

Addressing different problems with different solutions must be recognized for the benefit they impart to the community.

Trying to convince people that one proposal will solve another is a dilemma that only good education (and hopefully this listserve provides some of that) can solve.

Durham,  Can you spare a change is a volunteer effort to help provide an alternative for residents to consider before giving money directly to panhandlers.

The County Commissioners are considering a proposed ordinance to deal with another (safety on our streets and thoroughfares).

One is not meant to supplant the other.   However each of them, if implemented may supplement one another!  

I for one,  support both!

Mike Shiflett

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: pat carstensen 
  To: inc-list at durhaminc.org 
  Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 10:47 AM
  Subject: Re: INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

  I was just wondering -- has anyone ever seen anyone give money to a panhandler.   For all the time I spend stopped along 15-501, I've never seen money change hands.  Which makes me think that the panhandlers are like spammers -- very low success rate but enough traffic that it pays off.  which makes it sort of a needle in a haystack to find people who giv emoney.  But every one you convince to stop doing so cuts significantly into the return on effort for the panhandler.

  It would be interesting to see who gives money to panhandlers, how much they give each time, etc.

  Regards, pat

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    From: TheOcean1 at aol.com
    Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2007 09:50:21 -0400
    To: dchristie1 at nc.rr.com; randy at 27beverly.com; inc-list at durhaminc.org
    Subject: Re: INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

    Look carefully, Randy and Deb! 
    The intersections you are concerned about are virtually ALL inside the City limits. This proposed ban will NOT cover those.

    The Durham Can You Spare A Change Campaign is entirely separate and independent of Lewis Cheek's new law proposal. It merely suggests we not give money to panhandlers in all areas of Durham.

    Perhaps folks would stop standing at any intersection if we, the people of Durham, were to stop giving them money!
    Make sense?

    Feel free to support both ideas, but if the intersections are inside the City of Durham, the proposed ban will not effect them.

    Bill Anderson

    In a message dated 10/6/2007 3:07:27 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, dchristie1 at nc.rr.com writes:
      I agree with Randy.

      Spare a change and ban panhandlers at intersections.  It is really 
      dangerous.

      Deb Christie

      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "RW Pickle" <randy at 27beverly.com>
      To: <inc-list at durhaminc.org>
      Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 12:26 AM
      Subject: INC NEWS - Durham does need a change...

      > ban right-of-way solicitation in both the City and County!
      >
      > Durham can spare a change, get these folks off the right-of-way before
      > someone gets killed! Will it take that before we enact measures to protect
      > those, which others often say, have substance abuse problems or mental
      > capacity issues? Does it make any sense to leave these folks standing in
      > the middle of the road?
      >
      > The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration says that approximately
      > 6,500 pedestrians and 900 bicyclists are killed each year as a result of
      > collisions with motor vehicles. They don't split up the statistics, so you
      > can't see how many were panhandlers. It's not too hard to believe that it
      > was at least one (of the 6,500). So what if that next one happened to be
      > on 15-501 in Durham? Is it not our responsibility to act in a manner that
      > would create a safer environment for both panhandlers and those in
      > vehicles? How is keeping right-of-way solicitation a daily norm going to
      > make it any safer? It isn't. And when they get hit, I guess they can sue
      > the City for allowing them to stand there when the City had an opportunity
      > to stop them by passing an ordinance. Maybe even get $10 million for being
      > hit...
      >
      > As I said before (and Bill Anderson suggested in his last post), this is
      > about changing the ideas of those in cars who would roll down their
      > windows and give these folks something. And I don't care what you call it
      > and how many fliers you give out, you're not going to change human nature.
      > We are all taught compassion from an early age; to help those less
      > fortunate when we can. So now we're going to have this campaign to change
      > the way we think? I think those supporting this need to change their
      > minds. You'll never change kindness and generosity. It's human nature.
      >
      > Those who attended the last INC meeting heard about a new program in
      > Durham funded by the County, City, and the Triangle United Way (3 deep
      > pocketed groups). It deals with all the issues these panhandlers face (or
      > those who support another option would want you to believe); homelessness,
      > substance abuse, mental illness, and jobs). It would seem to me that
      > getting behind this already existing (and just getting started) program
      > would be a much better idea. It addresses all the issues these panhandlers
      > face and has a staff working toward their agenda. So if the County passes
      > their right-of-way solicitation ordinance, they are already working to
      > address the problems that group faces. Then the City can do the same
      > (since they're funding the new program as well). And the third party
      > involved with this new program, Triangle United Way, already funds most of
      > the charitable-help organizations already. So that's huge.
      >
      > Mike Shifflett said in a post earlier in the week:
      >
      > "However, with this amazement also comes a small feeling of disappointment
      > in the fact that in many cases there already exists or existed an
      > organization, community group, non-profit or neighborhood association that
      > actual has worked on that same issue or is currently working to improve
      > it.
      >
      > Year after year,  new and exciting groups form around the elections to
      > fight or advocate for more peace, less crime, more housing, increasing
      > police and law enforcement (read immigration) resources and/or
      > environmental issues.
      >
      > Thing is, in all of these instances, there exists just such a group of
      > concern citizens who would have loved to have more public support
      > themselves.
      >
      > But wouldn't it be great if we could all join together and work as a team?
      > I'm sure it would be more efficient.  I'm more than sure that the results
      > might be longer lasting as in many instances as these new groups then
      > either disband or diminish in strength as their particular issue plays out
      > (win or lose)."
      >
      > This "Durham Can You Spare A Change" idea is just that. It's a duplication
      > of another program that is actually trying to change things for those who
      > need it; not change us. The idea that you can change human nature is just
      > an up-hill battle. It just won't happen. And when one of the panhandlers
      > is hit and killed... their blood will be on your hands for not doing
      > something when you had the chance. Get them out of the road and get them
      > some help. Support the idea of banning right-of-way solicitation and
      > support the new County, City, and United Way initiative. You could save a
      > life...
      >
      > RWP
      > 27 Beverly
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      > INC-list mailing list
      > INC-list at rtpnet.org
      > http://lists.deltaforce.net/mailman/listinfo/inc-list
      > 

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